Allard Baird Defends Damon Trade

KCBOOMER · 04-04-2003, 11:06 AM

Yesterday the KC Star had an interview with Allard Baird, Royals GM. He admitted that trading Jermaine Dye for Neifi Perez was a major blunder but defended the Johnny Damon for Roberto Hernandez trade. This trade also included the Roayls giving the A's Mark Ellis for Angel Berroa. Supposedly Ellis was just a throw in, while Berroa was "the key to the deal".

Damon had to be unloaded. He would be a free agent at the end of the season and his agent is Scott Boras. They thought they desperately needed a closer (they had led the free world in blown saves the prior two seasons) and Hernandez was available. Had the Royals continued to generate runs like they had the first two seasons this might have worked out. Hernandez is a classic overpaid closer who will blow at least a fourth of his opportunites, but was substantially better than anyone else the Royals had. Paying the guy $6M was stupid to say the least.

At the time the Royals thought they were getting their shortstop of the future in Berroa, but did admit he was two years away. Well he has done his two years in the minors and seems like he will have no problem being a ML shortstop. The problem is his hitting has really regressed. He hit something like .205 at AAA last year. Sure he had some nagging injuries, but it would take a ton of walks and HRs (neither of which he had) to offset .205. Unless he can get his offense up to adequate his future is not good.

What-the-hell you say? We gave up one year of Damon for two years of Hernandez and that isn't that bad, particularly when you consider Damon had a pretty miserable year in Oakland. So what if Berroa is a washout? Well don't forget Mark Ellis the throw in. Seems like he played in some exhibition game last July. At this point it still seems like Oakland got the better of the deal and for years to come. If Berroa get his act together this deal could become a "push".

gyb13 · 04-04-2003, 12:30 PM

this from the latest installment on rob & rany on the royals:

Quote:

The worst sustained bullpen performance of all-time, I'd wager, was that of the 1999-2002 Royals. The 1999 season, the one in which the Royals went 11-32 in one-run games, is well-documented: it's the worst single-season bullpen performance, ever. So the Royals brought in Ricky Bottalico, with predictably disastrous results, which convinced the team to go out and get Roberto Hernandez, with predictably sub-mediocre results.

Let me frame the bullpen's performance this way: over the last four years, the Royals have gone 57-109 in one-run games. No, let me frame it another way: over the last four years, in one-run games on the road, the Royals have gone 19-73.

Stop and think about that for a moment. When you consider the powerful tendency to the mean in one-run games -- even 110-loss teams should win 35 percent of their one-run games, even on the road -- that may be the most amazing statistic I've ever seen.

LisaG · 04-05-2003, 08:36 AM

GMs still think neifi perez is valuable.... for some reason.

i'm still having a hard time with Jermaine Dye + mark ellis = roberto hernandez + angel berroa.

that is an amazing disparity in 1 run games. and no, hernandez didn't zackly help much.

SmedIndy · 04-05-2003, 01:39 PM

Allard misses the big point. Roberto Hernandez was useless to them. They needed a major infusion of talent, not someone who's fame was based on a practicially meaningless stat.

Fuzzy Bear · 04-08-2003, 07:34 PM

On top of it all, Angel Berroa is 25 years old, in reality!

Based on his last year's performance, he's a Grade D prospect at best. He'll have a Rey Ordonez/Pokey Reese career, if he's real, real lucky.

Of course, the Royals are 5-0 at this writing. I want to believe they'll keep it up, but Sweeney will have to contend for the Triple Crown for that to happen.

OaktownTribeFan · 04-09-2003, 12:28 AM

Sounds like Baird felt that this was a good time to toot his own horn, with KC still undefeated.

KC could easily go the way of the 2003 Indians, who started off hot as a pistol, and faded to oblivion.

KCBOOMER · 04-09-2003, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by OaktownTribeFan KC could easily go the way of the 2003 Indians, who started off hot as a pistol, and faded to oblivion.

Pretty easy call. The Royals in all honesty have zero chance to be a .500 club. We are just hoping for improvement.

OaktownTribeFan · 04-10-2003, 09:41 PM

KCBoomer, do they have some good prospects coming up? Even though I'm an Indians fan, I'm hoping for a resurgence in KC.

Their pitching sure is dominant right now. And looking over the hitters, Mayne is a big surprise, and Ibanez is off to an unreal start. Those might be flukes, eh?

Is it fairly definite that Sweeney going to be traded this summer? He's a FA after this year?

TenaciousD · 04-10-2003, 10:54 PM

I believe Sweeney holds an option after next year, if and only if KC is under .500 both years.

Beltran is a FA after next year as well, but they are more likely to deal him.

gyb13 · 04-10-2003, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TenaciousD
Beltran is a FA after next year as well, but they are more likely to deal him.

i thought Beltran was a FA after this year

nyy26wc · 04-11-2003, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by gyb13
i thought Beltran was a FA after this year

He won't have the service time until after the 2004 season.

poorme · 04-11-2003, 09:31 AM

i'm kind of interested in his "biggest mistake" -- the Dye trade. I don't think the mistake was trading Dye, but rather projecting Perez to be a star. When you trade for prospects, you get burned on occasion.

KCBOOMER · 04-11-2003, 09:53 AM

Beltran will be a free agent after the 2004 season.

Sweeney is signed through 2006 but can leave after 2004 if the Royals don't go .500 in either 2003 or 2004 (funny contract).

The Dye trade was a disaster and was immediately recognized as such when it occurred. Perez had virtually the same amount of big league service time as Dye and was already racking up monster negative RCAA numbers despite playing in Denver. He was well passed the prospect phase of his career. He was a panic move by Baird and Muser when they realized Rey Sanchez (I know he can't hit but he is a fine defensive shortstop) wouldn't be back the next season.

Mayne is a fluke. He's a career banjo hitter who is having his dayin the sun. Ibanez has hit the ball very well the last season-and-a-half and posted excellent numbers for 2002.

The young starters and the new bullpen have pitched very well which has been the key to the whole streak. It has been great to see pitchers throw strikes. We haven't seen that in a while.

Also, the competition we have faced hasn't been the stoutest. Yes, the White Sox are very good, but Cleveland is so-so (probably better than the Royals), and Detroit is very weak.

LisaG · 04-11-2003, 06:24 PM

no, gustavo, after next year (beltran is a FA)

Fuzzy Bear · 04-15-2003, 07:41 PM

That Baird didn't get fair value for Damon is indefensible. However, I find Damon to be an overrated player who costs more than he's worth. The idea of trading him wasn't the worst.

04-04-2003, 11:06 AM	#1
KCBOOMER NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Home of the T-Bones Posts: 11,116	Allard Baird Defends Damon Trade Yesterday the KC Star had an interview with Allard Baird, Royals GM. He admitted that trading Jermaine Dye for Neifi Perez was a major blunder but defended the Johnny Damon for Roberto Hernandez trade. This trade also included the Roayls giving the A's Mark Ellis for Angel Berroa. Supposedly Ellis was just a throw in, while Berroa was "the key to the deal". Damon had to be unloaded. He would be a free agent at the end of the season and his agent is Scott Boras. They thought they desperately needed a closer (they had led the free world in blown saves the prior two seasons) and Hernandez was available. Had the Royals continued to generate runs like they had the first two seasons this might have worked out. Hernandez is a classic overpaid closer who will blow at least a fourth of his opportunites, but was substantially better than anyone else the Royals had. Paying the guy $6M was stupid to say the least. At the time the Royals thought they were getting their shortstop of the future in Berroa, but did admit he was two years away. Well he has done his two years in the minors and seems like he will have no problem being a ML shortstop. The problem is his hitting has really regressed. He hit something like .205 at AAA last year. Sure he had some nagging injuries, but it would take a ton of walks and HRs (neither of which he had) to offset .205. Unless he can get his offense up to adequate his future is not good. What-the-hell you say? We gave up one year of Damon for two years of Hernandez and that isn't that bad, particularly when you consider Damon had a pretty miserable year in Oakland. So what if Berroa is a washout? Well don't forget Mark Ellis the throw in. Seems like he played in some exhibition game last July. At this point it still seems like Oakland got the better of the deal and for years to come. If Berroa get his act together this deal could become a "push". __________________ KCBOOMER *Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball*

04-11-2003, 09:53 AM	#13
KCBOOMER NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Home of the T-Bones Posts: 11,116	Beltran will be a free agent after the 2004 season. Sweeney is signed through 2006 but can leave after 2004 if the Royals don't go .500 in either 2003 or 2004 (funny contract). The Dye trade was a disaster and was immediately recognized as such when it occurred. Perez had virtually the same amount of big league service time as Dye and was already racking up monster negative RCAA numbers despite playing in Denver. He was well passed the prospect phase of his career. He was a panic move by Baird and Muser when they realized Rey Sanchez (I know he can't hit but he is a fine defensive shortstop) wouldn't be back the next season. Mayne is a fluke. He's a career banjo hitter who is having his dayin the sun. Ibanez has hit the ball very well the last season-and-a-half and posted excellent numbers for 2002. The young starters and the new bullpen have pitched very well which has been the key to the whole streak. It has been great to see pitchers throw strikes. We haven't seen that in a while. Also, the competition we have faced hasn't been the stoutest. Yes, the White Sox are very good, but Cleveland is so-so (probably better than the Royals), and Detroit is very weak. __________________ KCBOOMER *Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball*

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04-05-2003, 08:36 AM	#3
LisaG All-NetShrine Team Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: texas Posts: 371	GMs still think neifi perez is valuable.... for some reason. i'm still having a hard time with Jermaine Dye + mark ellis = roberto hernandez + angel berroa. that is an amazing disparity in 1 run games. and no, hernandez didn't zackly help much.

04-05-2003, 01:39 PM	#4
SmedIndy NetShrine's Historian Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Zionsville, IN Posts: 10,569	Allard misses the big point. Roberto Hernandez was useless to them. They needed a major infusion of talent, not someone who's fame was based on a practicially meaningless stat.

04-08-2003, 07:34 PM	#5
Fuzzy Bear NetShrine's Evangelist Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Living by faith, and not by sight! Posts: 2,194	On top of it all, Angel Berroa is 25 years old, in reality! Based on his last year's performance, he's a Grade D prospect at best. He'll have a Rey Ordonez/Pokey Reese career, if he's real, real lucky. Of course, the Royals are 5-0 at this writing. I want to believe they'll keep it up, but Sweeney will have to contend for the Triple Crown for that to happen.

04-09-2003, 12:28 AM	#6
OaktownTribeFan Inducted Into The NetShrine Assembly of Fame Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: The Bullpen Posts: 529	Sounds like Baird felt that this was a good time to toot his own horn, with KC still undefeated. KC could easily go the way of the 2003 Indians, who started off hot as a pistol, and faded to oblivion.

04-10-2003, 09:41 PM	#8
OaktownTribeFan Inducted Into The NetShrine Assembly of Fame Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: The Bullpen Posts: 529	KCBoomer, do they have some good prospects coming up? Even though I'm an Indians fan, I'm hoping for a resurgence in KC. Their pitching sure is dominant right now. And looking over the hitters, Mayne is a big surprise, and Ibanez is off to an unreal start. Those might be flukes, eh? Is it fairly definite that Sweeney going to be traded this summer? He's a FA after this year?

04-10-2003, 10:54 PM	#9
TenaciousD Having A NetShrine Cup Of Coffee Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 8	I believe Sweeney holds an option after next year, if and only if KC is under .500 both years. Beltran is a FA after next year as well, but they are more likely to deal him.

04-11-2003, 09:31 AM	#12
poorme Guest Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: washington dc Posts: 2,625	i'm kind of interested in his "biggest mistake" -- the Dye trade. I don't think the mistake was trading Dye, but rather projecting Perez to be a star. When you trade for prospects, you get burned on occasion.

04-11-2003, 06:24 PM	#14
LisaG All-NetShrine Team Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: texas Posts: 371	no, gustavo, after next year (beltran is a FA)

04-15-2003, 07:41 PM	#15
Fuzzy Bear NetShrine's Evangelist Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Living by faith, and not by sight! Posts: 2,194	That Baird didn't get fair value for Damon is indefensible. However, I find Damon to be an overrated player who costs more than he's worth. The idea of trading him wasn't the worst.

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