A's - White Sox Trade.

[mentos]

http://espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/1203/1470567.html

The White Sox traded reliever Keith Foulke, catcher Mark Johnson and pitcher Joe Valentine to the Athletics on Tuesday for closer Billy Koch and two minor leaguers, ESPN's Peter Gammons reports.

Looks like Kenny Williams was swindled again.
But I suppose that depends on the Minor leaguers involved.
But judging from his past moves, I can only assume they are non-factors.

[Craig S.]

I've never liked Koch. I'm still not sure that he understands how to pitch, and he allows way too many baserunners for a closer.

I think Oakland got the better of this one, surprising absolutely nobody.

[qtlaw]

Foulke's stuff is just as good as Koch's and I'm sure at a lower price. Koch's fastball was as straight as a ruler. Somebody get him a cutter.

[mentos]

Actually Foulke is more expensive than Koch.

Foulke - 4 Million
Koch - ~2.4 Million.

So is this
a) Williams getting completely duped (very possible)
b) A Salary Dump
c) Freeing up some Cash for a run at a big F.A.
(consider all the Frank Thomas money that is being deffered as well)

I haven't heard many rumors of F.As that the WSox were after... any South Side fans know of any?

[Max Power]

Prediction: Koch will spend at least a month on the DL this year............good deal by the A's (as usual).

[Sadaharu Oh]

The A's probably got the better, but not at their usual scale. Still, each of the "extras" in the deal should have decent value for the A's.

What are the contract status' (or status's, or statuses, or stati?) of Koch and Foulke?

[KCBOOMER]

Unless there is some big swing in the supporting players in this deal it looks like the Pale Hose got hosed. The last four years Foulke has pitched 352 innings and had an RSAA of 88 while Koch has only pitched 305 innings with 46 RSAA. I don't know how much they will make this year (Foulke made $1.6M more than Koch last year) but if Koch is arbitration eleigible the gap will be minimal.

[gyb13]

Foulke will make $6 mil in 2003, the final yr of his contract.
Koch made $2.5 mil in 2002 (incl 150K in bonuses). With arbitration this offseason, his salary is likely to double.

[boot2112]

Somebody has to stop Kenny Williams and fast. This is going to make the Todd Ritchie for Josh Fogg and Kip Wells trade look good. Koch is not as good as Foulke. So as bad as that deal would have been Williams felt necessary to throw in a solid major league catcher and a 22 closer prospect in Valentine. I would rather have Valentine closing than Koch. Now the White Sox have to go to arbitration with Koch removing a headach from the A's. Oh yeah the Sox gave cash also. This is a bad deal even on the Kenny Williams scale.

[LeGrandOrange]

I don't give a damn about statistics in this deal, all I see is the Athletics getting the #2 closer in all of major league baseball, #1 in my opinion because I don't like Rivera. A good deal for the A's, which means I hate them even more.

[poorme]

williams is looking long term (koch is tied up 3 years). beane is going for it all next year, as they can't afford him after next year. this deal depends on the minor leaguers involved. damaso marte is the sox closer right now, so i'm not sure why they made this deal. i think williams was trying to move foulke at all costs. manuel doesn't like foulke. his change up isn't manly enough.

[Sadaharu Oh]

I also like it from the A's standpoint, but I'll defend it from the White Sox POV....

Foulke -- He's very good, but they clearly didn't know what to do with him. Start? Close? Long Relief? He got wrongly jerked around too much and probably needed a new atmosphere and manager. For the Sox to pay him 6 million in his last year, when they don't even know what to do with him, may have been a bit much.

Johnson -- He's good, but the Sox will get younger and cheaper at the position. A backup C isn't hard to find.

Lawrence -- He's good too. He was also claimed off of waivers from Detroit, of all teams, last year. If players as good as him are on waivers then, they will be in the future.

Koch -- Is cheaper this year, but signed for longer. He's pitched a lot, but has shown no ill effects from it. Also, his WHIP dropped a lot this year while his k/bb rate inched up some.

Two minor leaguers -- To be announced later this month. Who knows.


I still like it from the A's side, but when I look at it from the other end, I can understand it too. Just trying to walk in Williams' shoes on this one...

[Doc Pontoon]

From a White Sox perspective, this trade stinks like zoo poo. You'd think that Kenny would at least try to avoid three-for-one trades after last year's debacle, or that he would learn that the word "veteran" isn't the same as the word "better", or that sometimes minor leaguers can become good major leaguers (I'm talking about Kennedy here). He learned nothing. What a dummy. Fire this jackass yesterday, please.

[Sadaharu Oh]

Originally posted by Doc Pontoon
You'd think that Kenny would at least try to avoid three-for-one trades after last year's debacle

This isn't a 3-1 trade. It's 3-3. Two minor leaguers will be added later, presumably after the Rule V draft.

[OaktownTribeFan]

Originally posted by Doc Pontoon


From a White Sox perspective, this trade stinks like zoo poo.

Zoo poo? Now THAT's funny.

Valentine is the real sleeper in this trade. He's BB Weekly's top-rated minor league reliever, and highly rated by scouts around the country. I think Beane has pulled another huge steal.