Game 3 No DH

VNV Nation · 10-21-2002, 03:20 PM

Other than Rob Neyer, has anyone hammered Dusty Baker for not putting Ryan Minor on the WS roster?

Minor would at least give the Giants a legitimate bat to put in there at DH.

Given the pathetic options the Giants have, isn't Dunston about the worst? Again, you could make the argument that some of the Giants' pitchers are better hitters.

Game 1 choice of Shinjo wasn't so hot either. And if you're going to put Shinjo in the lineup, shouldn't he be in the field, with Bonds or Lofton DHing?

Anyway, the Giants should have a huge edge in Game 3. Livan is not only a great postseason pitcher, he's a heck of a hitter. And Molina will find it more difficult to drive in runs when the pitcher is batting behind him, rather than David Eckstein.

Fullmer is a pretty good bat to take out of the lineup, and I don't think you can play him in the field. He's pretty horrendous.

KCBOOMER · 10-21-2002, 03:30 PM

As is usually the case going to the NL park gives the NL team a greater advantage than the Al gets when they play in the AL park.

VNV Nation · 10-21-2002, 03:32 PM

I'm not sure I agree with that. Having Fullmer instead of Dunston/Shinjo is a pretty big advantage.

qtlaw · 10-21-2002, 03:43 PM

I think Dusty gave Lofton the start in CF to assuage his ego. Minor has looked terrible the past couple of months. He takes huge hacks and does not have much plate discipline from my vantage point. Dunston almost had one hit. I'm sure that the Giants have a huge advantage at home with Wooton/Fullmer out. The Giants are used to playing this way. I just hope Livan has great movement on his pitches.

Gosfgiants · 10-21-2002, 03:44 PM

I think Dusty is following the sticking with my guys approach. I couldn't see Minor starting in game 1 against the Washburn. He would of been a good choice for game 2. He is not a good pinch hitter, so that keeps him out the games in SF. As far as Shinjo not playing the field, I heard that Dusty offered the choice to Lofton to DH or play the field. Lofton felt that he would be more effective all around if he played the field.

sweaver · 10-21-2002, 03:47 PM

So, why couldn't Shinjo go for Sanders in RF? At least Shinjo can throw.

JamesI · 10-21-2002, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sweaver
So, why couldn't Shinjo go for Sanders in RF? At least Shinjo can throw.

According to McCarver Sanders has an above average arm!
Of course this is McCarver...

spitball · 10-21-2002, 04:07 PM

Hopefully Molina bat's 7th so whoever's pitching can bunt Kennedy along.

calexpat · 10-21-2002, 04:40 PM

Dunston did get an rbi single, and Shinjo got a base hit on Saturday. So the actual results haven't been that bad. It was ludicrous to see Shinjo dhing and Lofton in center. Ego be damned, you can't give up that much of a defensive advantage. It didn't hurt on Saturday. But if the Giants had had Shinjo in center and Lofton dhing on Sunday, they might be up 2-0 now.

As for Minor, Dusty did give him a chance to play, and he failed with an awful August. Giants fans don't want to see Goodwin, Dunston, or Shinjo at the plate any more than Neyer does, but we're not convinced Minor was the answer. If he would have been any improvement at all, he wouldn't have been a major one...

gyb13 · 10-21-2002, 06:57 PM

what about DHing Russ Ortiz - 704 OPS in 02 (same as Snow)
<tongue-only-half-in-cheek>

Max Power · 10-21-2002, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by VNV Nation
Livan is not only a great postseason pitcher, he's a heck of a hitter.

Not true this season.

This year his BA (.234) was higher than is OBA (.231). His SLG% was .328. In terms of being a hitter, those numbers are Andy Benes territory.

In 2001 he had a good year with the bat. That was 12 months ago.

VNV Nation · 10-21-2002, 08:06 PM

He's a good hitter for a pitcher.

gyb13 · 10-21-2002, 08:13 PM

2002 NL OPS (min 45 AB)

894 Hampton
719 Jennings
704 Ru.Ortiz
641 Rusch
622 Neagle
577 Livan

Max Power · 10-21-2002, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by VNV Nation
He's a good hitter for a pitcher.

And the guy who "runs good for a catcher" is usually still slow compared to most runners.

Being a good hitter for a pitcher means Dunston, as bad as he is, is still a better option.

Gosfgiants · 10-21-2002, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Max Power
Being a good hitter for a pitcher means Dunston, as bad as he is, is still a better option.

Which will still be better than any of the Angels pitchers that end up batting for themselves in the next three games.

10-21-2002, 03:20 PM	#1
VNV Nation Membership Suspended 11/19/02 Join Date: May 2002 Location: VNV Nation Posts: 2,952	Game 3 No DH Other than Rob Neyer, has anyone hammered Dusty Baker for not putting Ryan Minor on the WS roster? Minor would at least give the Giants a legitimate bat to put in there at DH. Given the pathetic options the Giants have, isn't Dunston about the worst? Again, you could make the argument that some of the Giants' pitchers are better hitters. Game 1 choice of Shinjo wasn't so hot either. And if you're going to put Shinjo in the lineup, shouldn't he be in the field, with Bonds or Lofton DHing? Anyway, the Giants should have a huge edge in Game 3. Livan is not only a great postseason pitcher, he's a heck of a hitter. And Molina will find it more difficult to drive in runs when the pitcher is batting behind him, rather than David Eckstein. Fullmer is a pretty good bat to take out of the lineup, and I don't think you can play him in the field. He's pretty horrendous.

10-21-2002, 03:30 PM	#2
KCBOOMER NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Home of the T-Bones Posts: 11,116	As is usually the case going to the NL park gives the NL team a greater advantage than the Al gets when they play in the AL park. __________________ KCBOOMER *Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball*

10-21-2002, 03:44 PM	#5
Gosfgiants NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 1,136	I think Dusty is following the sticking with my guys approach. I couldn't see Minor starting in game 1 against the Washburn. He would of been a good choice for game 2. He is not a good pinch hitter, so that keeps him out the games in SF. As far as Shinjo not playing the field, I heard that Dusty offered the choice to Lofton to DH or play the field. Lofton felt that he would be more effective all around if he played the field. __________________ It'll always be Pacbell Park Beat LA!!!

10-21-2002, 04:40 PM	#9
calexpat All-NetShrine Team Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: New Haven, CT Posts: 448	Dunston did get an rbi single, and Shinjo got a base hit on Saturday. So the actual results haven't been that bad. It was ludicrous to see Shinjo dhing and Lofton in center. Ego be damned, you can't give up that much of a defensive advantage. It didn't hurt on Saturday. But if the Giants had had Shinjo in center and Lofton dhing on Sunday, they might be up 2-0 now. As for Minor, Dusty did give him a chance to play, and he failed with an awful August. Giants fans don't want to see Goodwin, Dunston, or Shinjo at the plate any more than Neyer does, but we're not convinced Minor was the answer. If he would have been any improvement at all, he wouldn't have been a major one... Last edited by calexpat : 10-21-2002 at 04:47 PM.

10-21-2002, 06:57 PM	#10
gyb13 NS Omnipresent Brasilian Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Crazy George's playground Posts: 10,903	what about DHing Russ Ortiz - 704 OPS in 02 (same as Snow) <tongue-only-half-in-cheek> __________________ Gustavo NDF Moderator Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin

10-21-2002, 03:32 PM	#3
VNV Nation Membership Suspended 11/19/02 Join Date: May 2002 Location: VNV Nation Posts: 2,952	I'm not sure I agree with that. Having Fullmer instead of Dunston/Shinjo is a pretty big advantage.

10-21-2002, 03:43 PM	#4
qtlaw Guest Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: El Cerrito, CA Posts: 668	I think Dusty gave Lofton the start in CF to assuage his ego. Minor has looked terrible the past couple of months. He takes huge hacks and does not have much plate discipline from my vantage point. Dunston almost had one hit. I'm sure that the Giants have a huge advantage at home with Wooton/Fullmer out. The Giants are used to playing this way. I just hope Livan has great movement on his pitches.

10-21-2002, 03:47 PM	#6
sweaver Netshrine Cleanup Hitter Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: The Mountain State Posts: 8,883	So, why couldn't Shinjo go for Sanders in RF? At least Shinjo can throw.

10-21-2002, 04:07 PM	#8
spitball Guest Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Studio City, Ca. Posts: 1,751	Hopefully Molina bat's 7th so whoever's pitching can bunt Kennedy along.

10-21-2002, 08:06 PM	#12
VNV Nation Membership Suspended 11/19/02 Join Date: May 2002 Location: VNV Nation Posts: 2,952	He's a good hitter for a pitcher.

10-21-2002, 08:13 PM	#13
gyb13 NS Omnipresent Brasilian Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Crazy George's playground Posts: 10,903	2002 NL OPS (min 45 AB) 894 Hampton 719 Jennings 704 Ru.Ortiz 641 Rusch 622 Neagle 577 Livan __________________ Gustavo NDF Moderator Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin

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