Did Bret Boone help or hurt his chances for the HOF this year?

Fuzzy Bear · 09-23-2002, 06:03 PM

I was just about to place a post on another thread suggesting that Bret Boone was one of those players that hurt, and possibly extinguished his chances for the HOF this year.

However, after looking at his stats on MLB.com, I'm not sure that it's true. In fact, Boone may have actually helped himself this year, despite the perception that he's been a disappointment.

Right now, Boone is at .275-23-104, with 86 runs scored. He's never been patient at the plate, but those numbers are all improvements over his previously established rates of offensive production per 162 games (an even bigger increase per 151 games, the # of games Boone has played in to date).

Can Bret stay in the game at 2B and average 19.6 jacks a year for six years? If he does, he'll have 300 career HRs, a big deal for a middle infielder.

Boone established himself as a possible HOFer in 2001 with his tremendous, out-of-context season. I said "possible". What I mean is that 2001 propelled Boone from a guy with no chance to a guy with a 10-15% chance at best, but whose chances could grow.

Boone's HOF chances seem to center around hitting 300 HRs while staying at 2B. This is not impossible. Boone's 2002 season moves his chances up from 10-15% to 15-20%. These chances will project forward rapidly as he attains 200 HRs (likely), makes the All-Star team a few more times (probable), and establishes himself as a 22-25 HR man at 2B for a few more years (possible, but he could also grow old overnight like Delino DeShields).

No, I'm not advocating Boone for the HOF at this point. I'm just stating what I believe his chances are right now, what this year meant to those chances, and what realistic possiblities for the future are. If Boone averages 20 HRs for 4 more years, that gives him 255 for his career. That is at least the Cooperstown gray area for a middle infielder. And I think, all things considered, that Boone actually took a step forward, not backward, this year.

gyb13 · 09-23-2002, 07:19 PM

what chances? Like all players in 2002, Boone added to this counting stats.... I think we should re-visit this one in a few years...

poorme · 09-23-2002, 08:13 PM

I predict he will fall prey to injuries in the coming years and not put up the necessary numbers. His muscles are probably too big for his ligaments.

09-23-2002, 09:15 PM

I never imagined Bret Boone as Hall of Fame type material.

Fatwater Fewl · 09-23-2002, 09:44 PM

You can't hurt what you don't have.

Boone will be 34 next April. His best season before his insane 2001 was 1998. He was 29. His stats looked like this:

R HR RBI SB BB BA OBP SLG

76 24 95 6 48 .266 .324 .458

According to baseball-reference , Boone really has no chance at the Hall.

Quote:

from baseball-reference
Black Ink: Batting - 4 (Average HOFer ~ 27)
Gray Ink: Batting - 28 (Average HOFer ~ 144)
HOF Standards: Batting - 19.9 (Average HOFer ~ 50)
HOF Monitor: Batting - 42.0 (Likely HOFer > 100)

JamesI · 09-23-2002, 09:47 PM

I think Bret is a long way short of the Hall. 300 homers doesn't seem likely for him. If Jeff Kent is short, Boone isn't even worth discussing.

LeGrandOrange · 09-23-2002, 10:04 PM

I was going to say the same thing as gyb13, "What chances?"

Bret Boone is this generation's Davey Johnson. And he's not close to being in as a player. I'd put him in as a manager, but that's irrelevant.
Boone would have to turn into Jeff Kent to be a HOF'er.

NCFella19 · 09-23-2002, 10:27 PM

Boone has just the same chance as I do to get into the HOF if we're both standing in line to buy admission tickets.

moose · 09-23-2002, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Fatwater Fewl
You can't hurt what you don't have.

bingo.

see season, fluke

Duque · 09-23-2002, 11:32 PM

Well, if Bob Boone ends up on the Veteran's Committee...

SmedIndy · 09-24-2002, 12:37 AM

Bret Boone has as much chance of getting to the HOF as Junior Kennedy.

pwdennis · 09-24-2002, 12:52 AM

It is hard to envision Boone as HOF material - he would have needed to maintain last year's productivity for two or three more years to be a serious candidate

VNV Nation · 09-24-2002, 12:53 AM

Do you think maybe we're getting carried away here...

The need to define all players by their relationship to Hall of Fame status is a little silly. What's next, "Is Eric Gagne a better HOF candidate than Bobby Thigpen" and a breakdown on the Hall of Fame chances of Aubrey Huff and Brian Jordan?

SmedIndy · 09-24-2002, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by VNV Nation
Do you think maybe we're getting carried away here...

The need to define all players by their relationship to Hall of Fame status is a little silly. What's next, "Is Eric Gagne a better HOF candidate than Bobby Thigpen" and a breakdown on the Hall of Fame chances of Aubrey Huff and Brian Jordan?

Well put. Everyone is a potential "future hall of famer" when they start their career.

Only those whose career has ended, or is clear will end soon, should really be discussed in a HOF context. All others can wait until the appropriate time.

poorme · 09-24-2002, 12:48 PM

I don't necessarily find these types of debates all that stimulating, but I'm sure many people find some (if not all) of my threads to be unspeakable.

IMO the more threads/questions/topics out there, the better. I can pick and chose the ones I partake in. What you find inane, someone else may like.

With that said, Bret Boone has about a 1% chance of making the hof. He would have to repeat last year for about 5 more years.

09-23-2002, 06:03 PM	#1
Fuzzy Bear NetShrine's Evangelist Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Living by faith, and not by sight! Posts: 2,194	Did Bret Boone help or hurt his chances for the HOF this year? I was just about to place a post on another thread suggesting that Bret Boone was one of those players that hurt, and possibly extinguished his chances for the HOF this year. However, after looking at his stats on MLB.com, I'm not sure that it's true. In fact, Boone may have actually helped himself this year, despite the perception that he's been a disappointment. Right now, Boone is at .275-23-104, with 86 runs scored. He's never been patient at the plate, but those numbers are all improvements over his previously established rates of offensive production per 162 games (an even bigger increase per 151 games, the # of games Boone has played in to date). Can Bret stay in the game at 2B and average 19.6 jacks a year for six years? If he does, he'll have 300 career HRs, a big deal for a middle infielder. Boone established himself as a possible HOFer in 2001 with his tremendous, out-of-context season. I said "possible". What I mean is that 2001 propelled Boone from a guy with no chance to a guy with a 10-15% chance at best, but whose chances could grow. Boone's HOF chances seem to center around hitting 300 HRs while staying at 2B. This is not impossible. Boone's 2002 season moves his chances up from 10-15% to 15-20%. These chances will project forward rapidly as he attains 200 HRs (likely), makes the All-Star team a few more times (probable), and establishes himself as a 22-25 HR man at 2B for a few more years (possible, but he could also grow old overnight like Delino DeShields). No, I'm not advocating Boone for the HOF at this point. I'm just stating what I believe his chances are right now, what this year meant to those chances, and what realistic possiblities for the future are. If Boone averages 20 HRs for 4 more years, that gives him 255 for his career. That is at least the Cooperstown gray area for a middle infielder. And I think, all things considered, that Boone actually took a step forward, not backward, this year.

09-23-2002, 07:19 PM	#2
gyb13 NS Omnipresent Brasilian Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Crazy George's playground Posts: 10,903	what chances? Like all players in 2002, Boone added to this counting stats.... I think we should re-visit this one in a few years... __________________ Gustavo NDF Moderator Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin

09-23-2002, 09:15 PM	#4
Doobster779 Posts: n/a	Huh I never imagined Bret Boone as Hall of Fame type material.

09-23-2002, 10:27 PM	#8
NCFella19 All-NetShrine Team Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 417	Boone has just the same chance as I do to get into the HOF if we're both standing in line to buy admission tickets. __________________ "It's not the high price of stardom that bothers me, it's the high price of mediocrity." -- Bill Veeck

09-23-2002, 11:32 PM	#10
Duque NetShrine's Desperado Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Southern CA Posts: 2,638	Well, if Bob Boone ends up on the Veteran's Committee... __________________ Bad Andy It's such a fine line between stupid and clever.

09-23-2002, 08:13 PM	#3
poorme Guest Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: washington dc Posts: 2,625	I predict he will fall prey to injuries in the coming years and not put up the necessary numbers. His muscles are probably too big for his ligaments.

09-23-2002, 09:47 PM	#6
JamesI Netshrine Vacuum Cleaner Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Potsdam, N.Y. Posts: 3,723	I think Bret is a long way short of the Hall. 300 homers doesn't seem likely for him. If Jeff Kent is short, Boone isn't even worth discussing.

09-23-2002, 10:04 PM	#7
LeGrandOrange Membership Suspended 4/11/04 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Tacoma, WA Posts: 3,783	I was going to say the same thing as gyb13, "What chances?" Bret Boone is this generation's Davey Johnson. And he's not close to being in as a player. I'd put him in as a manager, but that's irrelevant. Boone would have to turn into Jeff Kent to be a HOF'er.

09-24-2002, 12:37 AM	#11
SmedIndy NetShrine's Historian Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Zionsville, IN Posts: 10,569	Bret Boone has as much chance of getting to the HOF as Junior Kennedy.

09-24-2002, 12:52 AM	#12
pwdennis NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Winter Springs, FL Posts: 2,503	It is hard to envision Boone as HOF material - he would have needed to maintain last year's productivity for two or three more years to be a serious candidate __________________ "I would submit that if the world survives for a million years, perhaps its finest hour may be that in the last half of the 20th century, when the power to blow up the world rested in the hands of a few men in two very unsophisticated and suspicious countries, we didn't do it, and one American, Richard Nixon, moved the cold war away from permanent confrontation toward victory. How could any wrong that he did compare with that?" - John Sears

09-24-2002, 12:53 AM	#13
VNV Nation Membership Suspended 11/19/02 Join Date: May 2002 Location: VNV Nation Posts: 2,952	Do you think maybe we're getting carried away here... The need to define all players by their relationship to Hall of Fame status is a little silly. What's next, "Is Eric Gagne a better HOF candidate than Bobby Thigpen" and a breakdown on the Hall of Fame chances of Aubrey Huff and Brian Jordan?

09-24-2002, 12:48 PM	#15
poorme Guest Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: washington dc Posts: 2,625	I don't necessarily find these types of debates all that stimulating, but I'm sure many people find some (if not all) of my threads to be unspeakable. IMO the more threads/questions/topics out there, the better. I can pick and chose the ones I partake in. What you find inane, someone else may like. With that said, Bret Boone has about a 1% chance of making the hof. He would have to repeat last year for about 5 more years.

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