Top 20 Batters NL 1977-82

Max Power · 08-26-2002, 07:04 AM

OK, show of hands, without looking, how many people would have put Gene Richards on this list?

Code:

1977-1982  OWP Leaders 2000+ PA
    
1    Mike Schmidt               .735   
2    Reggie Smith               .728   
3    Dave Winfield              .687   
4    Gene Tenace                .686   
5    Ted Simmons                .673   
6    Keith Hernandez            .670   
7    Dave Parker                .665   
8    George Foster              .661   
9    Greg Luzinski              .661   
10   Joe Morgan                 .651   
11   Ken Griffey Sr.            .638   
12   Jack Clark                 .636   
13   Jose Cruz                  .633   
14   Ron Cey                    .618   
15   George Hendrick            .617   
16   Dusty Baker                .615   
17   Andre Dawson               .614   
18   Gary Carter                .609   
19   Gene Richards              .605   
20   Bill Madlock               .603

Skip · 08-26-2002, 08:43 AM

Until reading more about him elsewhere recently, I never would have put Gene Tenace in the top 5, either.

SmedIndy · 08-26-2002, 10:42 AM

Tenace I could see....ball four!

GENE RICHARDS?? Man, I guess slap hitting fast guys were able to contribute a bit then. Now, he'd be bench fodder.

KCBOOMER · 08-26-2002, 11:22 AM

I don't even remember him. Looks like a statistical fluke. He only played in more than 105 games five times and had a career OPS of .739 versus the league .731.

poorme · 08-26-2002, 11:31 AM

the question is what happened to him? his stats suggest he could have kept playing, especially in that era. quite a stolen base threat too. maybe he was a clubhouse cancer or something.

Fuzzy Bear · 08-26-2002, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by poorme
the question is what happened to him? his stats suggest he could have kept playing, especially in that era. quite a stolen base threat too. maybe he was a clubhouse cancer or something.

The Padres of that era had their share of druggies; Eric Show and Alan Wiggins were two, and they both died tragically. I don't remember Richards being named in their company, though.

It looks like Richards hit the pine when the Pads came up with two much better players, Gwynn and McReynolds, and a then-hot prospect in Carmelo Martinez.

Despite his speed, Richards was not a good defensive player, and sometimes played 1B. That seems odd for a player of his type, but I'm sure the Padres, in their bad years, needed his bat in the lineup some way. He may have been a guy who could run fast, but couldn't really play defense, and didn't have enough power for 1B. Not all guys who can hit but not field are big sluggers.

SmedIndy · 08-27-2002, 12:24 AM

He seemed to lose some of his speed after age 27. And for a player like him, if you don't have speed, you got bumpkus....

poorme · 08-27-2002, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SmedIndy
He seemed to lose some of his speed after age 27. And for a player like him, if you don't have speed, you got bumpkus....

or bupkis for that matter.

wskksw · 08-27-2002, 04:32 PM

intuitively, i would have dropped richards in the 13-17 area.
the surprises were hernandez on the up side, and madlock on the low side.
were these wpcts adjusted for park factors?

Max Power · 08-27-2002, 05:22 PM

Dunno:

OWP--Offensive winning percentage. It's a Bill James stat that projects what a team's winning percentage would be if each offensive player was cloned to that player and the team had an average pitching staff.

Lee?

Skip · 08-27-2002, 05:26 PM

I've seen people do OWP with and without park factors. I dont know what the "official" version (said loosely) does.

VNV Nation · 08-27-2002, 08:01 PM

James uses some complex method of figuring park factors...

Gene Richards, I remember getting his baseball cards and thinking that was a good thing. Hell of a player for a few years. But he did seem to get phased out when the Pads got better players: Lezcano, who wasn't really better but they traded Fingers for him. The 1984 outfield was pretty young and exciting, Tony Gwynn, Kevin McReynolds and Carmelo Martinez.

wskksw · 08-27-2002, 08:29 PM

mellow carmelo held the record for most walks in a year for a latin player for quite a while.

pwdennis · 08-27-2002, 10:08 PM

I always felt that the NL was in a down cycle for talent during the mid-70s to mid-80s. Schmidt and Smith appear to be the best of an undistinguished lot with only Schmidt and Smith appearing to be in their peak years

Alan Smithee · 08-27-2002, 11:59 PM

RIchards was a wonderful leadoff man for about five years but he lost a step and just fell of the face of the earth. look at his numbers from 1982 on. He also got kind of a late start , playing college ball and then hitting .381 at reno and .331 in the texas league before he got his chance. If you have no power, and you cant play D then you really have to get on base a lot and be very very fast. Guy like this loses a step and he's gone faster than you can say " ralph Garr."

also he played on the Padres in the late 70's. If he had been in Left for the Yanks or the royals durning that era we all would remember him.

08-26-2002, 11:22 AM	#4
KCBOOMER NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Home of the T-Bones Posts: 11,116	I don't even remember him. Looks like a statistical fluke. He only played in more than 105 games five times and had a career OPS of .739 versus the league .731. __________________ KCBOOMER *Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball*

08-27-2002, 05:22 PM	#10
Max Power NetShrine Creator & Curator Join Date: May 2002 Location: NetShrine WHQ Posts: 5,548	Dunno: OWP--Offensive winning percentage. It's a Bill James stat that projects what a team's winning percentage would be if each offensive player was cloned to that player and the team had an average pitching staff. Lee? __________________ Steve, Forum Administrator "They come and they go, Hobbs. They come and they go." That's why there's NetShrine.com

08-27-2002, 10:08 PM	#14
pwdennis NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Winter Springs, FL Posts: 2,503	I always felt that the NL was in a down cycle for talent during the mid-70s to mid-80s. Schmidt and Smith appear to be the best of an undistinguished lot with only Schmidt and Smith appearing to be in their peak years __________________ "I would submit that if the world survives for a million years, perhaps its finest hour may be that in the last half of the 20th century, when the power to blow up the world rested in the hands of a few men in two very unsophisticated and suspicious countries, we didn't do it, and one American, Richard Nixon, moved the cold war away from permanent confrontation toward victory. How could any wrong that he did compare with that?" - John Sears

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08-26-2002, 08:43 AM	#2
Skip NetShrine Vagabond Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Louisville Posts: 7,866	Until reading more about him elsewhere recently, I never would have put Gene Tenace in the top 5, either.

08-26-2002, 10:42 AM	#3
SmedIndy NetShrine's Historian Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Zionsville, IN Posts: 10,569	Tenace I could see....ball four! GENE RICHARDS?? Man, I guess slap hitting fast guys were able to contribute a bit then. Now, he'd be bench fodder.

08-26-2002, 11:31 AM	#5
poorme Guest Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: washington dc Posts: 2,625	the question is what happened to him? his stats suggest he could have kept playing, especially in that era. quite a stolen base threat too. maybe he was a clubhouse cancer or something.

08-27-2002, 12:24 AM	#7
SmedIndy NetShrine's Historian Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Zionsville, IN Posts: 10,569	He seemed to lose some of his speed after age 27. And for a player like him, if you don't have speed, you got bumpkus....

08-27-2002, 04:32 PM	#9
wskksw Membership Termed 10/02/02 Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 127	intuitively, i would have dropped richards in the 13-17 area. the surprises were hernandez on the up side, and madlock on the low side. were these wpcts adjusted for park factors?

08-27-2002, 05:26 PM	#11
Skip NetShrine Vagabond Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Louisville Posts: 7,866	I've seen people do OWP with and without park factors. I dont know what the "official" version (said loosely) does.

08-27-2002, 08:01 PM	#12
VNV Nation Membership Suspended 11/19/02 Join Date: May 2002 Location: VNV Nation Posts: 2,952	James uses some complex method of figuring park factors... Gene Richards, I remember getting his baseball cards and thinking that was a good thing. Hell of a player for a few years. But he did seem to get phased out when the Pads got better players: Lezcano, who wasn't really better but they traded Fingers for him. The 1984 outfield was pretty young and exciting, Tony Gwynn, Kevin McReynolds and Carmelo Martinez.

08-27-2002, 08:29 PM	#13
wskksw Membership Termed 10/02/02 Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 127	mellow carmelo held the record for most walks in a year for a latin player for quite a while.

08-27-2002, 11:59 PM	#15
Alan Smithee Guest Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 152	RIchards was a wonderful leadoff man for about five years but he lost a step and just fell of the face of the earth. look at his numbers from 1982 on. He also got kind of a late start , playing college ball and then hitting .381 at reno and .331 in the texas league before he got his chance. If you have no power, and you cant play D then you really have to get on base a lot and be very very fast. Guy like this loses a step and he's gone faster than you can say " ralph Garr." also he played on the Padres in the late 70's. If he had been in Left for the Yanks or the royals durning that era we all would remember him.

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