Best NL Gamer? Counsell?

qtlaw · 08-15-2002, 12:29 PM

First Eckstein, how about Counsell? As a Giants fan I hate to admit it but this guy is just like Dykstra, he's Nails . He plays hard, makes all the right plays, hardly has any bad at bats, gets clutch hits, and gets to show off two rings. Is he Forrest Gump riding the coat tails of Kevin Brown, Al Leiter, Sheffield, Gonzo, Randy and Schilling or is more likely that he is just as important as they are? Even though Matty is back and Spivey is an all-star, I would rather face those two with Counsell on the bench. BTW, why can't the Giants get a gnat like him? They have not had such a player since Brett Butler and Counsell hits the ball harder and farther.

SmedIndy · 08-15-2002, 12:35 PM

And now he's on the DL....http://espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/0814/1418077.html

qtlaw · 08-15-2002, 12:38 PM

Whops, I guess I whiffed on that one. Still doesn't change my opinion of him. I can only hope that with the glue out, the D'Backs fall on their kiester a bit and Los Gigantes start streaking.

spitball · 08-15-2002, 12:48 PM

I'm with you qtlaw. Counsell plays hard everyday...except when he's on the DL of course.

The Dodgers had him for awhile then let him go...typical.

moose · 08-15-2002, 04:24 PM

by "gamer," are we just saying:

1. small
2. "tough"
3. doesn't really have as much natural talent, but manages to stay in the bigs through hard work

???

i mean, no one with jason giambi's skills would ever be a "gamer."

spitball · 08-15-2002, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by moose
by "gamer," are we just saying:

1. small
2. "tough"
3. doesn't really have as much natural talent, but manages to stay in the bigs through hard work

???

i mean, no one with jason giambi's skills would ever be a "gamer."

You are correct sir

qtlaw · 08-15-2002, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by moose
by "gamer," are we just saying:

1. small
2. "tough"
3. doesn't really have as much natural talent, but manages to stay in the bigs through hard work

???

i mean, no one with jason giambi's skills would ever be a "gamer."

I certainly did not intend to use your definition. In my book a gamer is anyone who plays hard, is tough, and gets the most out of their talent and comes through in the clutch. Someone diving all over the place, doing just anything to win. This includes Eckstein, Pete Rose and Dykstra, but also Winfield, Mays, Pete Vukovich, Tug McGraw, Randy Johnson.

soxfan121 · 08-15-2002, 07:41 PM

"Gamers" are my favorite players. Eckstein and Counsell are the prototypes for today's game, but I'm sure there are tons of historical examples. However, as I am sure SmedIndy will point out sooner or later, everyone used to play the game this way, and it is only recently that the traits of the "gamer" have been rare and worthy of note.

Personally, I love Trot Nixon, dirt dawg and gamer. "Would run through a fence" is a phrase that often comes up in conversation 'round these parts about Nixon's hustle and desire.

VNV Nation · 08-16-2002, 01:39 AM

Will Clark and Dave Hollins were two of the greatest gamers ever.

Nixon is up there, too.

SmedIndy · 08-16-2002, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by VNV Nation
Will Clark and Dave Hollins were two of the greatest gamers ever.

Nixon is up there, too.

Yeh, no one expected Tricky Dick to become president, but he hung in there....

Skip · 08-16-2002, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SmedIndy
Yeh, no one expected Tricky Dick to become president, but he hung in there....

He was a gamer all right. I believe his game was .... Checkers.

Actually I hate the term 'gamer'. It seems by definition intended to be complimentary, while in every other sense the meaning is left up to the user to determine. Absolutely subjective. It falls into cliche land with me ... 'he's a gamer' = 'he comes to play' = 'he gives 110 percent'.

VNV Nation · 08-16-2002, 09:25 AM

I remember that one complimentary phrase that was thrown about Chipper Jones' way early in his career was simply, "He's a ballplayer."

Its' just one of those things you're supposed to understand.

moose · 08-16-2002, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skip
Actually I hate the term 'gamer'. It seems by definition intended to be complimentary, while in every other sense the meaning is left up to the user to determine. Absolutely subjective. It falls into cliche land with me ... 'he's a gamer' = 'he comes to play' = 'he gives 110 percent'.

i'm with ya, dawg, i'm with ya.

i just think it's a silly phrase. you would never call andruw jones a gamer, even if he plays the game as hard as eckstein or counsell.

pwdennis · 08-16-2002, 07:42 PM

let's just say he puts out maximum effort without any whining - by that definition any player can be a gamer"

Duque · 08-16-2002, 08:24 PM

I would think that Giambi is a gamer.

08-15-2002, 12:29 PM	#1
qtlaw Guest Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: El Cerrito, CA Posts: 668	Best NL Gamer? Counsell? First Eckstein, how about Counsell? As a Giants fan I hate to admit it but this guy is just like Dykstra, he's Nails . He plays hard, makes all the right plays, hardly has any bad at bats, gets clutch hits, and gets to show off two rings. Is he Forrest Gump riding the coat tails of Kevin Brown, Al Leiter, Sheffield, Gonzo, Randy and Schilling or is more likely that he is just as important as they are? Even though Matty is back and Spivey is an all-star, I would rather face those two with Counsell on the bench. BTW, why can't the Giants get a gnat like him? They have not had such a player since Brett Butler and Counsell hits the ball harder and farther.

08-16-2002, 07:42 PM	#14
pwdennis NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Winter Springs, FL Posts: 2,503	let's just say he puts out maximum effort without any whining - by that definition any player can be a gamer" __________________ "I would submit that if the world survives for a million years, perhaps its finest hour may be that in the last half of the 20th century, when the power to blow up the world rested in the hands of a few men in two very unsophisticated and suspicious countries, we didn't do it, and one American, Richard Nixon, moved the cold war away from permanent confrontation toward victory. How could any wrong that he did compare with that?" - John Sears

08-16-2002, 08:24 PM	#15
Duque NetShrine's Desperado Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Southern CA Posts: 2,638	I would think that Giambi is a gamer. __________________ Bad Andy It's such a fine line between stupid and clever.

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08-15-2002, 12:35 PM	#2
SmedIndy NetShrine's Historian Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Zionsville, IN Posts: 10,569	And now he's on the DL....http://espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/0814/1418077.html

08-15-2002, 12:38 PM	#3
qtlaw Guest Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: El Cerrito, CA Posts: 668	Whops, I guess I whiffed on that one. Still doesn't change my opinion of him. I can only hope that with the glue out, the D'Backs fall on their kiester a bit and Los Gigantes start streaking.

08-15-2002, 12:48 PM	#4
spitball Guest Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Studio City, Ca. Posts: 1,751	I'm with you qtlaw. Counsell plays hard everyday...except when he's on the DL of course. The Dodgers had him for awhile then let him go...typical.

08-15-2002, 04:24 PM	#5
moose Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Socs Posts: 3,400	by "gamer," are we just saying: 1. small 2. "tough" 3. doesn't really have as much natural talent, but manages to stay in the bigs through hard work ??? i mean, no one with jason giambi's skills would ever be a "gamer."

08-15-2002, 07:41 PM	#8
soxfan121 Renounced Membership 7/9/03 Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Live Free Or Die, USA Posts: 1,335	"Gamers" are my favorite players. Eckstein and Counsell are the prototypes for today's game, but I'm sure there are tons of historical examples. However, as I am sure SmedIndy will point out sooner or later, everyone used to play the game this way, and it is only recently that the traits of the "gamer" have been rare and worthy of note. Personally, I love Trot Nixon, dirt dawg and gamer. "Would run through a fence" is a phrase that often comes up in conversation 'round these parts about Nixon's hustle and desire.

08-16-2002, 01:39 AM	#9
VNV Nation Membership Suspended 11/19/02 Join Date: May 2002 Location: VNV Nation Posts: 2,952	Will Clark and Dave Hollins were two of the greatest gamers ever. Nixon is up there, too.

08-16-2002, 09:25 AM	#12
VNV Nation Membership Suspended 11/19/02 Join Date: May 2002 Location: VNV Nation Posts: 2,952	I remember that one complimentary phrase that was thrown about Chipper Jones' way early in his career was simply, "He's a ballplayer." Its' just one of those things you're supposed to understand.

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