Shawn Green - Sit Out (merged threads)

[captain_napalm]

I just wanted to get the scores on the day...

Instead, I was treated to a rant courtesy of Rob Dibble. The subject was Shawn Green's decision to sit out Yom Kippur.

Basically, he was going on about how Green let the fans and his teammates down, and that God would understand if he played, and he was a ballplayer first, yadda, yadda, yadda.

In the words of Bugs Bunny, "What a Maroon."

[Crash Course]

This is why I mostly only watch ESPN News............
ESPN is starting to get like MTV.
Remember when MTV actually played music videos?
Now, if you want music videos, you have to go to one of the "off shoot" MTV channels.
Same with ESPN. If you just want scores and highlights, you have to go to ESPN News.

[RedSeat]

Just when I thought I couldn't respect Dibble any less...

But he's not alone.
Black Jack

Anyone else have a problem with these consecutive paragraphs?

When athletes sign a contract, they know what is expected of them. I don't know what it is like to be a teammate of Green's, but if I was playing for the Dodgers, I know I would be disappointed (to put it mildly) if our team was in position to make the playoffs and this religious holiday took precedence over showing up with our teammates to fight for a division title.

I respect personal beliefs and respect anyone who stands up for what he believes in.

Do you, Jack?

[Crash Course]

FWIW, Game 5, ALDS at Seattle - I really wish BJ was jewish that night and it was YK - and he had followed Green's lead, but, I digress........

[nyy26wc]

I don't think Green is standing up for what he believes in.

I agree with my rest of my family, who are Jewish--If you believe in Yom Kippur, then you believe in all of Yom Kippur. You don't believe in the daytime part of it, but ignore the nighttime part.

[KCBOOMER]

I think we have established many times before that Rob Dibble is an idiot.

As for how much Yom Kippur does it take to be Yom Kippur, that is each person's decision.

[nyy26wc]

Originally Posted by KCBOOMER

As for how much Yom Kippur does it take to be Yom Kippur, that is each person's decision.

Yom Kippur is to Jews when Easter is to Christians. It is only a decision if you also consider it to one's own decision how much of Easter Day is actually Easter.

[mainsr]

I am a seriously lapsed Jew (haven't attended services in nearly 30 years, not raising my kids anything), so maybe I have no right to say this, but Shawn Green's decision to play tonight but not tomorrow is one of the phoniest moves I've seen. Either you observe the holiday, which runs from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday--or you don't. There is no halfway. What he's doing is like giving up something for only half of Lent.

However, I do not expect the Almighty to intervene. Dodgers win.

[nyy26wc]

Originally Posted by nyy26wc

Yom Kippur is to Jews when Easter is to Christians. It is only a decision if you also consider it to one's own decision how much of Easter Day is actually Easter.

I later found out that this wasn't as good an analogy as I had thought.

I spoke to one of my gentile friends and asked him if he could fill in the blank--For a Jew to consider only part of Yom Kippur to be the holiest day of the
day and to spend the rest of the time doing that which is strictly forbidden is the equivalent of a Christian spending part of Easter observing it and the rest _______________.

I was informed that Christianity does not have any days with the kind of rules of Yom Kippur.

So, that can explain why so many people have had difficulties understanding the point I've been trying to make about Green.

[Crash Course]

FWIW, Lee, in the Church of Baseball (btw, where, I'm studying to become a pastor), Opening Day might be considered the equivalent of Yom Kippur. It's the day where a fan demonstrates repentance and tries to make amends, atoning for past sins (aka failings) in their "fanship" of their fav team. What Green is doing is like saying, in the COB, that you would not watch all of OD, only part of the game. Now, what kind of member of the COB would you be if you only watched part of OD?

[mgoettsche]

Originally Posted by mainsr

I am a seriously lapsed Jew (haven't attended services in nearly 30 years, not raising my kids anything), so maybe I have no right to say this, but Shawn Green's decision to play tonight but not tomorrow is one of the phoniest moves I've seen. Either you observe the holiday, which runs from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday--or you don't. There is no halfway. What he's doing is like giving up something for only half of Lent.

However, I do not expect the Almighty to intervene. Dodgers win.

Yep, I agree. The guy I respect is that Goodman kid who played for Towson. Talmudic Jew, didn't play at all on the Sabbath.

[mainsr]

I heard he's playing ball in Israel...is that true?

[mgoettsche]

Yep, he's playing ball with the Maccabi Tel-Aviv team, which is one of the best teams in Europe (although I never knew Israel was in Europe).

Lee, your original analogy of a Christian holiday being equivalent to Yom Kippur isn't far off base...keep in mind that there are thousands of branches in the Christian tree and that each stresses different aspects of Christianity (some emphasize the crucifixion, some emphasize the resurrection, some just empahasize the New Testament). Catholics in most parts of the world have strict observances on a day like Good Friday (a national holiday in Catholic nations like The Philippines and even in some states in the United States). Strict Catholics will observe these days in a manner much like Jews observe Yom Kippur...fasting, not working at your regular job (you might offer volunteer work at a charity), etc. The intent of the holiday being that you are focussed on repentance and atonement.

That said, I believe that most Catholic dioceses (especially in the US) don't stress the observance of these holy days like the Jewish synagogues stress Yom Kippur, and thus the Christian ballplayers don't feel like they are shirking any duties when they play ball on these days.

Also, can Jews be granted dispensation from observance for special circumstances? If so, it could be that Green got a dispensation that allowed him to play during part of Yom Kippur.

[mainsr]

Hey, I'll stick with my analogy...Playing ball for half of Yom Kippur, which ran from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday, is like a serious Catholic giving up something he/she enjoys for only half of Lent.

To answer your question, yes, there are plenty of "dispensations" from Yom Kippur. Remember, this is the holiday where people fast from sundown to sundown. All sorts of people--little kids, pregnant women, sick people--don't have to fast. (Growing up, our family knew a guy who used to give blood the day Yom Kippur started so he wouldn't have to skip dinner.) And, of course, you don't have to go to services if you're an infant or in a hospital or something. But there is no way any rabbi would let a healthy, able-bodied guy like Green off the hook so he could go to work.

I can hear myself 30 years ago, in a whiny adolescent voice, asking my dad, "Yeah, but what difference does it make?" and my dad answering, "The difference is that there are lots of observant Jews who don't play baseball who are going to lose their job or be subject to ridicule or discipline because they want to be home from sundown to sundown on Yom Kippur and their ignorant boss is going to say, 'I'm not letting you off both nights. That Jew on the Dodgers worked half of Yom Kippur. So should you.'" Green really did Judaism a disservice.

[nyy26wc]

Originally Posted by mainsr

Hey, I'll stick with my analogy...Playing ball for half of Yom Kippur, which ran from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday, is like a serious Catholic giving up something he/she enjoys for only half of Lent.

I like my great uncle's analogy--to consider Yom Kippur to only be the day part is like declaring Thursday to only cover 10 AM-5 PM.