Not Horne

KCBOOMER · 01-20-2004, 10:32 AM

When did umpires begin rubbing baseballs with a special clay from a former players farm?

UtterChaos · 01-20-2004, 04:51 PM

Hey, isn't Lena Blackburne mentioned in another question the answer?

sid · 01-20-2004, 04:57 PM

lena blackburne started providing mud to the majors in 1939 to take the shine off the balls

sid · 01-20-2004, 05:00 PM

what other first was lena blackburne responsible for?

01-20-2004, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sid

lena blackburne started providing mud to the majors in 1939 to take the shine off the balls

Different sources give different dates - in theory the umps first used his mud in 1921 - and he began to sell it to the American League in 1938 (or 1930...depending on who you ask) and the national league later......

KCBOOMER · 01-20-2004, 05:49 PM

Blackburne supplied clay from his NJ farm to the umpires beginning in 1921. In 1930 he switched to the now celebrated Delaware mud.

tyruschen · 01-20-2004, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCBOOMER

Blackburne supplied clay from his NJ farm to the umpires beginning in 1921. In 1930 he switched to the now celebrated Delaware mud.

Forgive my dumbness. Why we have to rub the ball "with speicific clay"?

sid · 01-20-2004, 11:40 PM

It all began in 1938 when an umpire complained to Lena Blackburne, a third base coach for the old Philadelphia Athletics, about the sorry condition of the baseballs used by the American League. Back then a ball was prepped simply with mud made of water and dirt from the playing field. The result? The ball's cover was too soft, leaving it open for tampering. Something was needed to take off the shine but not soften the cover.

this is according to the official website at baseballrubbing.com

01-21-2004, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sid

It all began in 1938 when an umpire complained to Lena Blackburne, a third base coach for the old Philadelphia Athletics, about the sorry condition of the baseballs used by the American League. Back then a ball was prepped simply with mud made of water and dirt from the playing field. The result? The ball's cover was too soft, leaving it open for tampering. Something was needed to take off the shine but not soften the cover.

this is according to the official website at baseballrubbing.com

That's baseballrubbingmud.com.....

But I think they are wrong (even though this is from the family business) - almost everyone says it started in 1921, KC says he then started giving them Delaware Mud in 1930, but I think that may be wrong as Blackburne's farm in New Jersey was on the Delaware River - thus Delaware mud. What is for sure is that he started to sell it to the AL in 1938 and then the NL in the 50's.

Oh, and I sent an Email to Jim Bintliff (whose in charge there) asking if he could clarify......

tyruschen · 01-21-2004, 11:11 AM

Thanks sid & Elmo!

01-21-2004, 01:00 PM

From Jim Bintliff of the "Lena Blackburne Baseball Rubbing Mud."

If anyone pokes around and finds out something definitive, I'd sure like to share it with Jim....

"Steve,
I'm sorry I have no definitive answer. I know that at the end of the dead ball era there was a problem with the new covers on baseballs. My guess is umpires were probably using the mud in the 20's. All I know for sure is that in 1938 the American Association was using it as a league. I am trying to get more background as time goes on.
Be sure though,this is the same mud that Lena found way back then."

sid · 01-21-2004, 05:32 PM

the answer to the original question, "from a players farm",is 1939. prior to that, as i posted the balls were rubbed with mud made from the clay on the field which was not satisfactory, so lena went home after the 38 season and discovered his mud.

KCBOOMER · 01-21-2004, 09:45 PM

Guys, the original question was about the clay Idirt if you will) not the mud.

sid · 01-25-2004, 11:32 PM

I need a review on this one . The dirt(clay) came from a players farm and it came before Lena Blackhorne started providing his mud in 1939

01-25-2004, 11:59 PM

well...you have my answer...mud/clay 1921 then some disputed dates 1930,1938,1939 and on and on....

01-20-2004, 10:32 AM	#1
KCBOOMER NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Home of the T-Bones Posts: 11,116	Not Horne When did umpires begin rubbing baseballs with a special clay from a former players farm? __________________ KCBOOMER *Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball*

01-20-2004, 05:49 PM	#6
KCBOOMER NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Home of the T-Bones Posts: 11,116	Blackburne supplied clay from his NJ farm to the umpires beginning in 1921. In 1930 he switched to the now celebrated Delaware mud. __________________ KCBOOMER *Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball*

01-21-2004, 11:11 AM	#10
tyruschen Inducted Into The NetShrine Assembly of Fame Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Taiwan Posts: 533	Thanks sid & Elmo! __________________ I'm a fanatic MLB fan from Taiwan and I fear you would'nt understand my bad English. Thanks a lot for reading.

01-21-2004, 09:45 PM	#13
KCBOOMER NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Home of the T-Bones Posts: 11,116	Guys, the original question was about the clay Idirt if you will) not the mud. __________________ KCBOOMER *Buck O'Neil: The Monarch of Baseball*

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01-20-2004, 04:51 PM	#2
UtterChaos All-NetShrine Team Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 399	Hey, isn't Lena Blackburne mentioned in another question the answer?

01-20-2004, 04:57 PM	#3
sid NetShrine MVP Join Date: May 2002 Location: nj Posts: 227	lena blackburne started providing mud to the majors in 1939 to take the shine off the balls

01-20-2004, 05:00 PM	#4
sid NetShrine MVP Join Date: May 2002 Location: nj Posts: 227	what other first was lena blackburne responsible for?

01-20-2004, 11:40 PM	#8
sid NetShrine MVP Join Date: May 2002 Location: nj Posts: 227	It all began in 1938 when an umpire complained to Lena Blackburne, a third base coach for the old Philadelphia Athletics, about the sorry condition of the baseballs used by the American League. Back then a ball was prepped simply with mud made of water and dirt from the playing field. The result? The ball's cover was too soft, leaving it open for tampering. Something was needed to take off the shine but not soften the cover. this is according to the official website at baseballrubbing.com

01-21-2004, 01:00 PM	#11
Elmo Posts: n/a	From Jim Bintliff of the "Lena Blackburne Baseball Rubbing Mud." If anyone pokes around and finds out something definitive, I'd sure like to share it with Jim.... "Steve, I'm sorry I have no definitive answer. I know that at the end of the dead ball era there was a problem with the new covers on baseballs. My guess is umpires were probably using the mud in the 20's. All I know for sure is that in 1938 the American Association was using it as a league. I am trying to get more background as time goes on. Be sure though,this is the same mud that Lena found way back then."

01-21-2004, 05:32 PM	#12
sid NetShrine MVP Join Date: May 2002 Location: nj Posts: 227	the answer to the original question, "from a players farm",is 1939. prior to that, as i posted the balls were rubbed with mud made from the clay on the field which was not satisfactory, so lena went home after the 38 season and discovered his mud.

01-25-2004, 11:32 PM	#14
sid NetShrine MVP Join Date: May 2002 Location: nj Posts: 227	I need a review on this one . The dirt(clay) came from a players farm and it came before Lena Blackhorne started providing his mud in 1939

01-25-2004, 11:59 PM	#15
Elmo Posts: n/a	well...you have my answer...mud/clay 1921 then some disputed dates 1930,1938,1939 and on and on....

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