Fielder's Choice: Baseball's Best Shortstops by Michael Hoban

sweaver · 08-08-2003, 03:00 PM

I haven't read it, but had my attention called to this book by David Pinto in his Baseball Musings weblog. He references a Newark Star-Ledger article on it, because it questions Hogan's rating of Derek Jeter as the worst fielder among current shortstops.

Now, this isn't news to fielding stats veterans. Most fielding ratings put Jeter pretty low, and I for one have talked about Jeter's defense hurting the Yankees. But, of course, it's scandalous to Yankee fans. Here's the article: http://www.nj.com/yankees/ledger/ind...0621325020.xml

The book is available here: http://www.booklocker.com/books/1243.html Hoban is a math Ph.D. at Monmouth University (NJ), an emeritus at CUNY, and a member of SABR. He does apparently put a lot of stock in fielding percentage, although I haven't found his formula yet. In the book, though, he also throws in a hitter evaluation, so it's a smorgasbord.

He's been kicking this stuff around for awhile, because I found a 1997 Cincinnati Enquirer article on his evaluation of Tony Perez: http://www.enquirer.com/columns/sull...122197_ts.html Craig Wright is quoted in the article as having some doubt about Hoban's methods.

Hoban also has a book entitled "Baseball's Complete Players," available on amazon.com, which appears to attempt to do the same as the Total Player Rating, Win Shares, and WARP. I have seen some bad reviews, however, to the effect that Hoban ignores park effects and league contexts, and comes to the conclusion that Earl Averill was better than Mickey Mantle.

There's a review of Hoban's work available in an on-line SABR journal (PDF file) at http://philbirnbaum.com/btn1999-02.pdf

pwdennis · 08-09-2003, 11:05 AM

Hoban's book ranks Ozzie Smith the best shortstop of all time. Rabbit Maranville and Cal Ripken Jr. -- never known for his range -- rank Nos. 2 and 3, respectively. Hoban's equation also confirms that the Indians' Omar Vizquel -- a nine-time Gold Glove winner -- is the best fielding shortstop playing today.

The above is a quote from the article - unless Hoban is speaking strictly of defense - his methodology would be suspect. Even if he is confining himself to defense I have my doubts

Has anyone ever broken players fielding stats down according to performance on artificial turf and natural grass ? I particularly would like to see Oz's splits

nyy26wc · 08-09-2003, 12:17 PM

If anyone ever wanted to justify censorship, there is no better exhibit than him. SABR-L was a much better list while he was banned from posting.

If you offered to pay me to read his books, you'd still have your money in your pocket.

sweaver · 08-09-2003, 04:05 PM

I got the impression Hoban was not welcome anymore at SABR, and had trouble dealing with criticism.

PW, I do believe those rankings were defense only.

08-08-2003, 03:00 PM	#1
sweaver Netshrine Cleanup Hitter Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: The Mountain State Posts: 8,883	Fielder's Choice: Baseball's Best Shortstops by Michael Hoban I haven't read it, but had my attention called to this book by David Pinto in his Baseball Musings weblog. He references a Newark Star-Ledger article on it, because it questions Hogan's rating of Derek Jeter as the worst fielder among current shortstops. Now, this isn't news to fielding stats veterans. Most fielding ratings put Jeter pretty low, and I for one have talked about Jeter's defense hurting the Yankees. But, of course, it's scandalous to Yankee fans. Here's the article: http://www.nj.com/yankees/ledger/ind...0621325020.xml The book is available here: http://www.booklocker.com/books/1243.html Hoban is a math Ph.D. at Monmouth University (NJ), an emeritus at CUNY, and a member of SABR. He does apparently put a lot of stock in fielding percentage, although I haven't found his formula yet. In the book, though, he also throws in a hitter evaluation, so it's a smorgasbord. He's been kicking this stuff around for awhile, because I found a 1997 Cincinnati Enquirer article on his evaluation of Tony Perez: http://www.enquirer.com/columns/sull...122197_ts.html Craig Wright is quoted in the article as having some doubt about Hoban's methods. Hoban also has a book entitled "Baseball's Complete Players," available on amazon.com, which appears to attempt to do the same as the Total Player Rating, Win Shares, and WARP. I have seen some bad reviews, however, to the effect that Hoban ignores park effects and league contexts, and comes to the conclusion that Earl Averill was better than Mickey Mantle. There's a review of Hoban's work available in an on-line SABR journal (PDF file) at http://philbirnbaum.com/btn1999-02.pdf

08-09-2003, 11:05 AM	#2
pwdennis NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Winter Springs, FL Posts: 2,503	Hoban's book ranks Ozzie Smith the best shortstop of all time. Rabbit Maranville and Cal Ripken Jr. -- never known for his range -- rank Nos. 2 and 3, respectively. Hoban's equation also confirms that the Indians' Omar Vizquel -- a nine-time Gold Glove winner -- is the best fielding shortstop playing today. The above is a quote from the article - unless Hoban is speaking strictly of defense - his methodology would be suspect. Even if he is confining himself to defense I have my doubts Has anyone ever broken players fielding stats down according to performance on artificial turf and natural grass ? I particularly would like to see Oz's splits __________________ "I would submit that if the world survives for a million years, perhaps its finest hour may be that in the last half of the 20th century, when the power to blow up the world rested in the hands of a few men in two very unsophisticated and suspicious countries, we didn't do it, and one American, Richard Nixon, moved the cold war away from permanent confrontation toward victory. How could any wrong that he did compare with that?" - John Sears

08-09-2003, 12:17 PM	#3
nyy26wc NetShrine All-Century Team Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: NJ Posts: 14,584	If anyone ever wanted to justify censorship, there is no better exhibit than him. SABR-L was a much better list while he was banned from posting. If you offered to pay me to read his books, you'd still have your money in your pocket. __________________ Lee Creator, Complete Baseball Encyclopedia. It's powerful, yet extremely easy to use. Features extensive sorting and stat display options. The CBE has many features that are not available in online and printed sources. Has 2006 stats and daily update service for 2007.

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08-09-2003, 04:05 PM	#4
sweaver Netshrine Cleanup Hitter Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: The Mountain State Posts: 8,883	I got the impression Hoban was not welcome anymore at SABR, and had trouble dealing with criticism. PW, I do believe those rankings were defense only.

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