Biggest Of The Big Reds?

[Max Power]

Who is the greatest Reds player of all-time - and why?

[trripleplay]

Big Klu was the reason for the invention of the Reds' sleeveless uniforms, because his arms muscles were too constrained by sleeves. OK, so maybe he wasn't the greatest of the Big Red, but he was the Biggest of the Great Reds.

[WiredTiger]

I would say Joe Morgan is the Biggest of the Big Reds. He is one of the top players at his position in baseball history and was a leader on those teams.

[KCBOOMER]

I went with Bench. The #1 or #2 rated catcher of all time. I really wante to vote for Robby (he is one of my favorite players) but he spent too much time in the uniforms of other teams. Rose was never the best on his own teams so I can't give him the nod here. As for Morgan I have always felt that his greatness, like Craig Biggio, was created by Bill James through some pretty convoluted statistical meanderings. Also, Morgam played more years with the Astros than the Reds.

[pwdennis]

Ask yourself this question : who would you LEAST like to face with a runners on first and second and a one run lead ? I think that the answer to that question would be a hitter who hits for a high batting average and has a lot of power.

The answer to that question is Frank Robinson

[Ytown Tribe fan]

To me, the greatest player to wear a Reds uniform was Frank Robinson, but the greatest Red was Bench.

[Max Power]

1st seven votes in and no one picks Rose.............hmmmmm

[Skip]

Originally posted by Ytown Tribe fan
To me, the greatest player to wear a Reds uniform was Frank Robinson, but the greatest Red was Bench. I agree. Bench is the one.

[JamesI]

Originally posted by Ytown Tribe fan
To me, the greatest player to wear a Reds uniform was Frank Robinson, but the greatest Red was Bench.

Excatly why I voted for Bench. Frank was great as a Red, but he's in the Hall of Fame as an Oriole.

[gyb13]

Originally posted by Ytown Tribe fan
To me, the greatest player to wear a Reds uniform was Frank Robinson, but the greatest Red was Bench. :agree:

[LeGrandOrange]

I concur the sentiment about Frank Robinson; I think of him as an Oriole more than I do as a Red.

I think I probably should've voted for Bench or Rose because of a longer tenure, but I picked Joe Morgan because he's the guy with 2 MVP awards among that group. Plus he's the best 6-tool player.

[Skip]

LGO: JB has 2 MVP too.

[KCBOOMER]

Originally posted by Ytown Tribe fan To me, the greatest player to wear a Reds uniform was Frank Robinson, but the greatest Red was Bench.

Wish I had said that.

[KCBOOMER]

Originally posted by LeGrandOrange
I picked Joe Morgan because he's the guy with 2 MVP awards among that group. Plus he's the best 6-tool player.

I don't see this at all. Robby had 2 MVP's (yes one was in the AL), a triple crown, a RoY (okay that's kind of a bogus award), and a gold glove. He even stole a couple hundred stolen bases. The only advantage Joe had was playing 2B on a great team which resulted in some marginal gold gloves. Joe also stole a ton of bases but Robby stole over 200 bases also. But Robby beat the league OPS by .200 for his career versus Morgan's .100. Also Robby had an RCAA of 852 versus Morgan's 663.

Robby was a Red longer, too.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Originally posted by KCBOOMER
As for Morgan I have always felt that his greatness, like Craig Biggio, was created by Bill James through some pretty convoluted statistical meanderings. Also, Morgan played more years with the Astros than the Reds.

I sometimes agree with this statement. Perhaps my pre-sabermetric coming of age has resulted in latent resistance to some sabermetric concepts. (I really don't believe that Joe Morgan was the greatest 2B that ever lived, although I don't think it's ridiculous to claim that he was; I just don't believe it.

I voted Bench, with Rose a close second, in my mind. I voted Bench because:

A. Bench played his entire career with the Reds, AND:

B. Bench is the player on that list with the most valid claim (IMO) of being the greatest player of all time at his position. (I believe his claim is stronger than Morgan's, plus he logged much more time in as a Red.)

[sweaver]

I'll go for Pete. 458 Win Shares as a Red, compared to 356 for JB. Larkin is 3rd all-time, by the way.

Pete was an all-star level player for the Reds from 1963-78, and also managed them and played some (mostly without distinction) later.

[pwdennis]

Just as an FYI

Frank Robinson spent ten seasons as a Cincinnati Red, playing 1502 of his 2808 games as a Red.

As a Red:
He had his three biggest RBI seasons
His three highest batting averages
161 of his 204 career steals
6 times finished in the top 10 in MVP voting
9 times in the top 8 in slugging percentage (#1 four times)
9 times in the top 7 in home runs

Except for 1963 (when he was injured) Robby was unbelievably consistant and productive. Bench or Morgan may have had a peak season or two that exceeded Robby's best season but neither of them put up a ten year stretch even remotely comparable. Even the 1963 off-season wasn't that bad of a season

[Fuzzy Bear]

I do want to say that this was a tough choice. I really wanted to vote for Frank Robinson, but I guess I think of him more of an Oriole, although his time with the Reds was longer, and probably greater. Perhaps it is a second thought.

For some reason, it seems to be forgotten that Johnny Bench also won two (2) MVP awards. Perhaps this pales with Morgan because (a) Morgan won them back to back and (b) Morgan won them more recently. Plus, Morgan is still very much in the baseball spotlight.

I wish more of my choces has such delightful alternatives! :agree:

[sweaver]

F. Robby had 278 Win Shares as a Red, 5th on the all-time team list.

[pwdennis]

That's an awful lot of Win Shares for a ten year period

[sweaver]

Pete had 458 in 18 years as a Red, for an average of 25.4 per year, which included the tail end of his career.

Robby had 278 in 10 years as a Red, and that does not include his decline period in his average of 27.8 per year.

[TimmyB]

Originally posted by Ytown Tribe fan
To me, the greatest player to wear a Reds uniform was Frank Robinson, but the greatest Red was Bench.

Exactly. (So that means I voted for Bench)

[pathogan]

...one of the few you could say was the best of both teams

[pathogan]

if many of our votes are affected by the fact that many people havent seen Mays in action,or frank robinson,et.al....numbers only tell part of the story