30 Years ago today

[rc3000]

I would be remiss if I didn't note the 30th Anniversary of the death of my all-time no questions asked favorite athlete . Considering I was 6 years old and raised in Massachusetts to have a favorite athlete not named Bobby Orr was strange. But luckily I began following sports in 1971 and the Pirates were on game of the week a lot and in the World Series. I still remember running home from first grade to watch the World Series. How great a player do you have to be for a six year old to sit there and watch you throw a baseball and realize you are the best player on the field. To this day outfielders with a cannon for an arm are my favorites and I don't know if it is subconcious or a style of play but to this day Latin players are my favorite players.

As I got older the more I read about the man the more impressed I became with him as a person not just a great outfielder. My sister-in-law eventually married a man from Puerto Rico and I was amazed when talking with him to realize the impact on Puerto Rico he still has.
Everyone knows the story of why he was on that plane 30 years ago and although it is a sad story it is one more reason I am so proud to wear my circa 1970's Pirates cap everywhere I go.

Happy New Year everyone.

[Skip]

That was the only third time in a year's worth of posts, approx 5000 posts overall, that I cried. Dammit. And I am a fan, but not a FAN, of RC, so this is weird. Jerk. Thanks. Wahh.

[Ytown Tribe fan]

I was 15 at the time, living halfway between P'burgh and Cleveland.

I can still vividly remember getting the paper and showing the headline to my dad. We just couldn't believe it -- it's hard to believe to this day.

It seemed we had just been down to Point Park to celebrate the World Championship, but that was the year before. '72 was just another baseball year for us -- we were Tribe fans after all, and had "borrowed" the Bucs victory of the year before.

The Great One. I still get chills thinking about him. He died a hero's death, but then, how else could he go?

[Max Power]

He's still the Babe of PR:


CAREER
BIRTHPLACE: PUERTO RICO

RCAA RCAA
1 Roberto Clemente 409
2 Bernie Williams 354
3 Orlando Cepeda 349
4 Roberto Alomar 340
5 Carlos Delgado 304
6 Jose Cruz 279
7 Juan Gonzalez 271
8 Danny Tartabull 259
9 Sixto Lezcano 146
10 Ivan Rodriguez 66

Even if Bernie passes him, or Alomar, or Carlos, they still owe him for paving the way of 'today's' Latin stars...........

[sweaver]

Rest In Peace, Roberto. You have not been forgotten.

If you ever go to a ballgame in Pittsburgh, at beautiful PNC park, make a point to find Roberto's statue. It's bronze and larger than life. His desire even burns through the statue's eyes.

Somewhere, Roberto still rounds third to score a run, and throws out any runners who dare to attempt an extra base on him.

[pwdennis]

It's very few in life who die a truly heroic death. Clemente was one of those few. He is worth remembering, both as a pretty decent ballplayer, and as a man of courage and conviction

[hmrsf]

rc3000

posters like you will always keep me surfing the net!


There are hereo in baseball, in our neighborhoods, all around us......we just have to look and follow their lead.

[Max Power]

I like to think it was because of Roberto making the sacrifice and setting an example that we see ballplayers today (like below) taking the time and risk to do good things when they just as easily could be spending time with the families during a Holiday time:

New York Yankees pitcher Roger Clemens throws a ball during his visit to Bagram Air Base near Kabul December 21, 2002:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/021221/170/2wrg2.html


New York Yankee pitcher Roger Clemens, left, autographs the hat of an American soldier during his visit Saturday, Dec. 21, 2002 to Bagram Air Base in Afghanistan. Clemens and comedian Drew Carey were with the United Service Organizations to give entertainment to forces involved in Operation Enduring Freedom for the holiday season: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/021221/168/2wrad.html

[clemente21]

rc3000, we're the same age, and I feel the same way about Roberto. I remember that whenever the Cubs played the Pirates, Jack Brickhouse used to make a point of what a great player he was and that no Cub was crazy enough to try and score on his arm.

We forget that he didn't have the childhood experiences that the African-American players of that era did, so when he came to the US, he had to adjust to racial issues as well as language issues. That he came off as difficult with the media is to an extent understandable and forgivable.

His OPS in 1972 was the same as his career average. He was only healthy enough to play the field for 100 games a year, but I have always wondered low long he could have DHed every other day for an American League team in a city with a large Puerto Rican fan base, such as the 75-81 Yankees.

[hmrsf]

clem21-

I can very much understand what you are saying. My roots I strongly suspect go back to Hell's Kitchen so I can understand American's new immigants.

I admire men like Clemente and my childhood hereo is Dewey Evans is close in character and playerwise to great Roberto.

Baseball can link generation through history and players.

[pathogan]

...my favorite player to watch,another guy to whom stats dont really matter. If Clemente had walked often, would it not have been beacause Latin ballplayers lacked "aggresiveness"?There was alot more riding on his shoulders than on most. Stats are nice, but they dont simply tell the whole story. a terrific ballplayer, and a better man. Somewhere, in the hall of fame for mensch's, Roberto stands tall...

[KCBOOMER]

Clemente was a tremendous player though not quite in the top 50 when you look at OPS and RCAA. Possibly the greatest arm of all right fielders. His fame primarily rests on getting killed in an airplane crash. He is a cultural icon in Puerto Rico and widely admired for his humanitarian efforts. He was not a great man if family values are in the equation. He was terribly flawed in that sense.

Dying well doesn't offset reality. Mickey Mantle courage in facing death doesn't offset his failures as a father and husband.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Originally posted by KCBOOMER
Clemente was a tremendous player though not quite in the top 50 when you look at OPS and RCAA. Possibly the greatest arm of all right fielders. His fame primarily rests on getting killed in an airplane crash. He is a cultural icon in Puerto Rico and widely admired for his humanitarian efforts. He was not a great man if family values are in the equation. He was terribly flawed in that sense.

Dying well doesn't offset reality. Mickey Mantle courage in facing death doesn't offset his failures as a father and husband.

Clemente's fame has been enhanced, somewhat, by the way he died, but not as much as KCBoomer suggests.

The 1970s were a time when Clemente, though aging, was emerging as a star. The Pirates had a resurgence, winning the division in 1970, and the World Championship in 1971, in the first World Series played on prime time TV. Although injured for part of 1972, Clemente achieved his 3,000th hit, and was, along with Henry Aaron, emerging from the shadow of Mays and Mantle.

I do want to speak about the issue of "family values". I'm not aware of Clemente's flaws in this area, but I'll assume that they are there, for the sake of this post, since a lot of athletes have them. While I would like everyone to be excellent husbands and fathers, and there are consequences for falling short in these areas, failure in the domestic front doesn't offset Clemente's very real efforts to alleviate human suffering.

King David, who is a generalized role model for underdogs, committed adultery, murdered to cover it up, and had one of the most dysfunctional families in history. (Biblical history is full of dysfunctional families, by the way.) His family had things going on (his son raping his daughter, for example, another son plotting to kill him) that would fodder for the Jerry Springer show today. Yet David was a great King, a significant historical figure, a brave warrior, and a man who the Bible says had "a heart after God's own".

We create heroes to tear them down, these days. We glorify in their warts, their failures, perhaps so we can say to ourselves, "See! I'm better than that!", or "See! He ain't all that!" If Clemente fell short in that area, that's too bad. "He who covers a transgression soweth love." I will still celebrate his attempts to alleviate human suffering, and hold them up to others as noble and worthwhile.

Another thing I remember about Clemente is that, if he hadn't died, few would have known of his attempt to help with Nicaraguan relief. Clemente's efforts were conducted outside the glare of the spotlight; only his disappearance and death brought his humanitarian efforts to general knowledge. He was doing a good and right thing almost anonymously. Had he lived, his efforts would be forgotten today, if they had been cited in the first place, but they would have been no less real.

[pwdennis]

A lot of our forum members were not alive (or at least too young to remember) when Clemente was active. Being an old fart of 50 I remember him quite well.

The only knock that I recall on Clemente was that he was a bit of a whiner and a hypochondriac, neither of which represent real character flaws. Aside from the above almost all coverage and commentary about Clemente was positive. He was a proud, fiercely competitive athlete who was among the best ever to play the game. He played at a time when there were a lot of good right fielders (Aaron, F. Robinson, Kaline) so he was usually not considered to be quite the lead hoss but he got, and deserved a lot of respect.