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gyb13
03-08-2002, 02:24 PM
Seems like some 'pop' picks...what would you guys like to go back and see, if you could?
Going back in time ...
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By Rob Neyer
ESPN.com

As an adolescent, my fantasies often involved invisibility, because if I were invisible I could walk around in the girls' locker room. Eventually, though -- sometime after my 18th birthday, if I recall correctly -- the concrete joys of adulthood allowed me to focus on a different kind of magic: time travel. Like a lot of history buffs, I considered (and still consider) the past more interesting than the present, which of course leads to fantasies about traveling back and seeing things for myself.

The problem is, where in the past does one start? I'd love to see a game in every old ballpark, love to see every great pitcher work, love to see the players toss their gloves to the ground after each half-inning, love to see every World Series Game 7 (starting with 1960). But today I'll limit myself to three games on the wish list, all of them from at least 50 years ago and all of them in living color.

1. September 23, 1908: The Polo Grounds, New York
It's been described as "the most celebrated, most widely discussed, most controversial contest in the history of American sports," and it just might be.

As September 23 dawned in New York, the hometown Giants and the Chicago Cubs -- two teams who had won the previous four National League pennants -- were locked in a virtual tie for first place; both of them stood 37 games over the .500 mark, with the Giants technically leading by .006. The Cubs had swept a doubleheader the day before, leaving the clubs with critical games on the 23rd and 24th.

This game was a pitcher's duel, as both New York's Christy Mathewson and Chicago's Jack "The Giant Killer" Pfiester performed brilliantly. The Cubs scored first, on Joe Tinker's solo home run. The Giants tied the game in the sixth when Turkey Mike Donlin singled home Buck Herzog. Heading into the bottom of the ninth, it was still 1-1. But after the Giants' leadoff man made out, Art Devlin singled. He was forced at second base on Moose McCormick's grounder, but rookie first baseman Fred Merkle followed with a base hit that sent McCormick all the way to third. And then Al Bridwell rapped a clean single to center, chasing McCormick home with the winning run and giving the Giants undisputed possession of first place.

Or so everyone thought. Merkle, rather than touch second base, headed directly to the clubhouse beyond center field. Cubs second Johnny Evers had kept his eye on Merkle, and after Merkle peeled away from the baseline, Evers frantically called for the baseball. Eventually he touched second base while in the possession of a baseball -- which baseball, nobody knows -- then appealed to base umpire Bob Emslie. Emslie hadn't seen the play and asked his partner, Hank O'Day, and O'Day granted the appeal, thus declaring Merkle out and negating McCormick's run.

That should have forced the contest into extra innings. But the fans had overrun the field and the Giants had left the premises, so O'Day ruled the game a tie, a decision that would be upheld by National League president Harry Pulliam. And of course, it mattered because the Giants and Cubs finished the season in a tie, necessitating a replay of the "Merkle game" that's often (incorrectly) remembered as a one-game playoff. The Cubs won the make-up game, and went on to beat the Tigers in the World Series for the second straight year.

So why go back? To answer two questions.

Did Merkle actually touch second base at some point before making his way to the clubhouse? The New York Herald reported that he did, probably because Christy Mathewson said that he did. (Mathewson, by the way, supposedly promised to quit professional baseball if the Giants lost the pennant as a result of Chicago's "trick of argument." They did, but he didn't.)

Did the Cubs ever record the force at second base? There are half a dozen stories about what happened to the game ball. And though it'd be difficult to get a clear picture of the postgame events, what with fans and players milling about the field, I'd sure like to give it a shot.

And as an added bonus, I'd get to see Christy Mathewson pitch against the world's greatest baseball team.

2. October 1, 1932: Wrigley Field, Chicago
Did Babe Ruth call his shot in Game 3 of the 1932 World Series, or didn't he? Nearly everybody who has studied the issue has concluded that Ruth did not, in fact, point to a distant spot beyond the center-field fence at Wrigley Field. Still, he did make a gesture of some sort, and accounts differ as to what that gesture actually was.

So I'd like to be deposited at the corner of Clark and Addison the morning of the game, where I'd hope to pay a scalper the going rate for a box seat between home plate and the third-base dugout. From there, I'd be well situated to contribute the most accurate eyewitness account of the famous events.

Aside from the obvious curiosity value, this game also featured another home run from Ruth and two from Lou Gehrig. Still, I had a tough time deciding between this one and a game in Pittsburgh on May 25, 1935, when Ruth, playing for the Boston Braves, hit three home runs in a single game. Those were the final three home runs of his career, and No. 714 was reportedly the longest blast ever hit at Forbes Field.

3. October 3, 1951: Polo Grounds, New York
The name is the same, but these Polo Grounds aren't the same Polo Grounds the Giants called home in 1908. These Polo Grounds sit below Coogan's Bluff, atop which I stood during the 2000 World Series, and looked across the East River toward Yankee Stadium in the distance. But the Polo Grounds are just a memory, a name given to the public-housing towers that now occupy the site.

So I want to see the real Polo Grounds, the Polo Grounds so vividly brought to life by Don DeLillo in his novel, Underworld. But I also want to know if Bobby Thomson knew that Ralph Branca was going to throw him that fastball that turned into The Shot Heard 'Round the World. Thomson claims that the Giants' sign-stealing system didn't help him on that particular pitch, but I'd like to see for myself. Did someone out in the bullpen give him the signal that a fastball was on the way? Or did Thomson simply see the pitch and hit it, fair and square?

Fritz Buelow
03-08-2002, 02:57 PM
:mad: I'm pissed. I swear to Ruth that I was going to start a thread on this about five days ago - - "If you could go back in time and see one game from history, which would you pick" - - but, I thought "Ah, save it for another day."

Neyer stole it from my brain - 'tho I have no proof whatsoever. Dang.

gyb13
03-08-2002, 03:10 PM
Well, Neyer doesn't do cool things like give out mugs for replies. ;)Let's get this started before the Espn user-response goes up.

As many of you know, I have NEVER been to a game, what with the number of MLB games in Brasil and all. This will be the year in which all this changes. So here are a couple of nominees for games I would've liked to go in the distant past:

11 & 15 Jun 1938 - Johnny VanderMeer tosses back-to-back no-hitters against Boston (3x0) and Brooklyn (6x0).

10 Aug 1944 - Boston Braves 2x0 Cincinnati Reds
Red Barrett throws a 58-pitch two-hitter and the game is over in just 1 hour and 15 mins.

KCBOOMER
03-08-2002, 03:16 PM
Well I don't have exact dates but:

1) Dodgers beats Yanks in the 7th game of 1955 WS 2-0.
2) Opening day for the brand new Yankee Stadium.
3) I don't care what game but I would like have seen Honus Wagner play.

Fritz Buelow
03-08-2002, 04:06 PM
Originally posted by KCBOOMER
Opening day for the brand new Yankee Stadium.

I actually made that one. Wish I had kept the stub. I was only 13 then and too stupid.

Skip
03-08-2002, 04:27 PM
1. 1970 All Star Game. First year I attended MLB. New, local stadium. Fosse and Rose. Hello Big Red Machine.

2. Any 1972 NL post-season game. First year I really "got" baseball. Saw several games that year, but none in the postseason. Still have never seen a postseason game in person.

3. Ripken's record game. Not a huge huge fan, but I still get goosebumps remembering it from TV. Cant imagine what it would have been like in person. Plus, I had my first Camden Yards game in person earlier that year.

KCBOOMER
03-08-2002, 04:52 PM
Originally posted by Fritz Buelow
I actually made that one. Wish I had kept the stub. I was only 13 then and too stupid.

I meant the NEW Stadium not the renovated one. I want to see the Babe.

Fritz Buelow
03-08-2002, 05:01 PM
Originally posted by KCBOOMER
I meant the NEW Stadium not the renovated one. I want to see the Babe.

How do you know that I'm not something like 94 years old? Maybe I was at the new one? Just kidding.

gyb13
03-08-2002, 05:49 PM
Originally posted by Skip
3. Ripken's record game. Not a huge huge fan, but I still get goosebumps remembering it from TV. Cant imagine what it would have been like in person.
Me too! I almost put that on my list, but decided to leave it out and concentrate on games long past...

By the way, this thread should be about a GAME you would've liked to see, not a particular ballplayer or stadium. We can save those for other threads. ;) I'm interested in the type of one-game accomplishment that ignites the fan in you...

pathogan
03-08-2002, 08:47 PM
Dont know how I missed this thread...
1}Dodgers finally win the series behind Podres,1955{for my mom, who introduced me to baseball}
2} Any Negro League game from the early to mid 1930's featuring the pittsburgh Crawfords and Homestead Grays
3} a chance to see Ted Williams take bp, say in late summer 1941,before the world changed

TGwynn19
03-08-2002, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by gyb13

Me too! I almost put that on my list, but decided to leave it out and concentrate on games long past...

By the way, this thread should be about a GAME you would've liked to see, not a particular ballplayer or stadium. We can save those for other threads. ;) I'm interested in the type of one-game accomplishment that ignites the fan in you...


in random order:

game 5 '84 NLCS...I almost broke my hand in my celebration

game 1 '88 WS probably the most memorable baseball moment in my generation

McGwire's 62nd home run...history and Sammy was there

Final game of the season of 1972 for Pittsburgh

Final game of the 1952 season, attended at the Polo Grounds.

Opening day in Brooklyn 1947

And quite possibly the game i would like to have been at the most: Lou Gehrig Day at Yankee Stadium.

Fritz Buelow
03-08-2002, 09:32 PM
5/1/20 - - the 26 innining game that ended up a 1-1 tie, both pitchers going all the way. BTW, time of the game was 3 hours, 30 minutes. Number Two would be the Pine Tar game.

rza93
03-08-2002, 11:26 PM
Lou Gehrig's last home game at Yankee Stadium, where he gave the famous speech.

ps - i forgot that famous line, what was it?

Fritz Buelow
03-08-2002, 11:50 PM
Originally posted by rza93
i forgot that famous line, what was it?

Tell me you're just busting 'em.

sweaver
03-09-2002, 08:52 AM
On the espn.com poll, I picked the Satchel Paige/Dizzy Dean barnstorm game. That would be fun.

There's the 1909 World Series, with a young Ty Cobb's Tigers facing veteran Honus Wagner's Pirates. That would be cool.

Almost any World Series would qualify. The 1952 and 1953 Yankees-Dodgers battles were all barn-burners, and would be very exciting.

I'd like to go back and see the very first professional game, by Harry Wright's Red Stockings. I wonder if we would recognize it as baseball?

nyy26wc
03-09-2002, 09:13 PM
I'll go with 2 great World Series Game 7s--

1960
1962

SmedIndy
03-09-2002, 09:37 PM
I'd go with the game where Chris von der Ahe and Charles Comiskey stalled and stalled, told the ump it was too dark, and went out and got lanterns and candles and arranged them around the St. Louis Browns dugouts in a vain effort to convince the ump to call the game in the last years of the great Browns dynasty of the AA.

Then I'd try to attend the last 41 or so games of the 1899 Cleveland Spiders to see how morale really was on a team destined to be 20-134.

LeGrandOrange
03-11-2002, 10:14 AM
If I wanted to hit the way back machine, in an attempt not to change history, it'd be to October 18, 1977. I would just loved to have been in the stands when Reginald Martinez Jackson popped those 3 homers in the World Series at Yankee Stadium. I'm not a Yankee fan, but I'm a MAJOR, MAJOR Reggie fan, and I would've just loved to have seen that at the ballpark...would have loved to have seen Reggie become Mr. October in person.
There's probably other moments, but I'm strangely at a lack of finding anything cooler then that, so that's "the" pick for me.

pic41
03-11-2002, 11:51 AM
Stan's 5 homers in a doubleheader
Ted's homer in last at bat
Mickey's blast in washington

Duque
03-11-2002, 05:32 PM
Larsen's perfect game in the World Series would be great...or Gibson's record-setting K game in the WS.

bill wisnosky
03-11-2002, 06:20 PM
Ted Williams busting up laughing when Rip Sewell throws his infamous "Blooper Ball" in an All Star game and then jacking it out of the ballpark.......... PS I saw Rip throw that Blooper several times and I swear it sometimes came down from 20 feet in the air.....:rolleyes:

WiredTiger
03-14-2002, 10:46 AM
Decisions... Decisions...

Bobby Thomson Shot Heard Round the World game
Game 7 of the 1955 world series when Brooklyn finally wins
game 7 of 1909 world series. Would love to see how Bennett Park looked back then. Ty Cobb, Honus Wagner.

TimmyB
03-28-2002, 04:53 PM
1) Game 8 of the 1903 Series
2) Game (? Last game of series) 1918
3) Season-ending double-header in Philly in 1941 when Ted went 6-8 to bring his average to .406
4) 1932 Series -- Did Ruth really call the shot?
5) Game 7, 1955
6) Game 6, 1975
7) Game 6, 1986 (Maybe then I can get close enough to the dugout and yell to McNamara and tell him to pull Schiraldi and get Stapleton in there for Buckner!)
P.S. I still think Buckner was a great ballplayer.

hmrsf
03-28-2002, 06:14 PM
Welcome TimB!

Make that a time travel for 2. Picked great games!I also think Buckner was a great player who will be remembered for one illfated moment.

tenkevcardinal
03-29-2002, 09:21 AM
How about this past world series game 7. It was a great, great game, plus I'd get to see the Yankees lose a heartbreaker. Muhahaha.